Duel of Wits/Persuasion Beginners Questions

The real problem with the DoW as presented is that the guy with the sword has no reason to due. If somehow the question ended up being debated in front of a court of nobles, or even a bunch of guys with swords and the ability to enforce the will of whoever is more convincing, maybe it’s good. But alone in a dungeon? The guy with the sword has no reason to argue? Here’s how it goes:

“I think you should give me the sword.”
“Cute. I think you should shut up.”

And that’s it. Any argument requires two participants, and both participants need a reason to participate. The stakes here range from complete reversal of fortunes to status quo; the best case scenario for the guy with the sword is no change. He’d be a fool to debate unless he has pressing reasons (like beliefs, or instincts) to do so.

Rolling persuasion against a PC is usually worse. If it’s important enough that the PCs are arguing, it probably should be a DoW so there can be a compromise. If not, or if any compromise is impossible, one of the PCs is just going to say, “No,” and walk off. Always remember that your choices when faced with a duel of wits are to ante up or walk away.

I don’t see that as a problem.

This would be a) why most people don’t go away from civilization with people they don’t trust (well, actually, most people don’t go alone into dark alleys with skeevy people, much less dungeons…) and b) why things like the Pirates of the Caribbean movies are all about having something as insurance you can hold over someone else - an item, a hostage, information or a unique skill. “You NEED me!”

That said, if you’ve got nothing, and aren’t able to get physical (or run away) consider the value of Begging or Inconspicuous (“Forget it. You’re not worth killing. When you get back, I’ll be in charge of the city, and everyone will see you for what you are - a pathetic fool.”).

Chris

Sometimes someone has no reason to argue and you’re just shit out of luck.

Sometimes someone has no reason to argue and they find themselves getting into an argument anyway.

The way I got past this stumbling block is by remembering that the person who wants to enter the dual needs some way to get the other person interested. By hooking a belief or putting something out there that the other person wants you can shift it from a straight Persuasion at Will Ob. to a DoW.

“I think you should give me the sword.”
“Cute. I think you should shut up.”
“All right, I guess I won’t tell you what I heard about your father…”

That said, it’s on the part of the person who wants to get the sword to bait the belief and to put something on the line for it. That then changes the possible outcomes from “Keep the Sword and forward my belief” to “Lose the sword.”

Depending on when/how the stonewalling happens there is always the chance that the person walking away from the DoW is just being obstructonist in which case they may be playing the wrong game.

The Pirates of the Caribbean movies are perfect examples of characters with excellent Beliefs and why no one ever says “shut up.”

But if there are no Beliefs to hit, “shut up” is actually a viable answer.

If there are no beliefs to hit…play better!

Too snarky? :wink:

Cash dice! Everybody likes money! :wink:

(I’m pretty sure a savvy player could entice another with something cool, on personal, meta and ‘character’ level.)

Remeber that there’s a trait vote coming, beeing perceived as a social coward, a dreg, a blocker or just anti-social or even unfriendly can leave one with undesireable traits. :wink: