Martial Arts in Fight!

Can the “Charge” and “Great Strike” options be used with the Martial Arts skill in place of Power in Charge, and empty hands and feet in place of two hands on a weapon in Great Strike?

(Envisioning Flying Side Kick type of Charge with Roundhouse and Axe Kicks for Great Stirkes)

Should these require some form of Die Trait?

Should Practiced Precision be able to apply to the Great Strikes? Effectively reducing it to 1 Action, only from an Agressive Stance? (still limited to your weapon speed number of strikes)

I would argue that no, Power should still be used in Charge, but I would entertain the argument as a GM. As far as Great Strike, it specifically says it can be used with Boxing (which is the same thing as Martial Arts).

I was going to say that Practiced Precision can’t be used in combat and accuse you of munchkinism, but it appears that’s not true at all. It clearly states that it can be used with combat maneuvers, though it only reduces them by 1 action, rather than to 1 action.

Given that, I don’t even see a reason for the limitation to Aggressive Stance. It normally takes two actions, and according to PP, that can be reduced by 1 action. Congrats, you found a totally legal way to completely replace Strike with Great Strike!

Now I’m envisioning a barbarian, just smashing his way past an opponent’s shield (Great Strike ignores Block) and bashing through armor (+1 VA) or knocking his enemy senseless with brutal strikes (+1 damage).

The intent was not for Great Strike, but rather all the other combat actions: standing up, drawing a weapon, nocking a bow, etc.

Hirram: You may also be remembering a line that was removed from the Revised version.

For using Skill instead of Power for damage, you need the Deadly Precision trait, which costs 5 trait Points in Character Burning.


Does this apply to spell or social actions?


I thought “Set” and “Great Strike” were separate actions, with set just being a prereq of Great Striking.

But maybe that’s just my inner mean GM talking.

Looking at Gold, in the Practiced Precision trait: “Combat-related actions may be Practiced Precision trademarks. They are only reduced by one action, rather than reduced to one action.”

I don’t see where that is limited to combat actions other that Great Strike. Is there somewhere that is stated, or where it lists what actions, specifically, Practiced Precision is meant to apply to? The section on Fight Actions consistently refers to things like Strike, Block and Great Strike as actions.

From the Great Strike entry: “Great Strike costs two actions to perform. On the first action, you take a breath to set up your attack. You are effectively defenseless on this action; you count as Stand and Drool hesitating.”

Cost out a trait that lets you get +1 Power or +1 VA on any Strike with a weapon that theoretically could Great Strike. If that trait would be way more than Practiced Precision, then don’t allow it. If the trait would be at most a bit more than Practiced Precision, then allow it.

Checking the Monster Burner, which is admittedly out of date with Gold, we see scaled costs of traits that increase Power or VA of natural weapons.

Base natural weapon cost: 3 points

Go from Power 1 to Power 2: +1 point
Go from Power 2 to Power 3: +1 point
Go from Power 3 to Power 4: +2 points
Go from Power 4 to Power 5: +4 points

Go from VA 0 to VA 1: +1 point
Go from VA 1 to VA 2: +3 points
Go from VA 2 to VA 3: +12 points

So a trait that is limited to striking with a weapon that could Great Strike but can be used to increase your choice of Power or VA, with any base Power or VA? Gotta cost it nearer the top of the range, not the bottom. I’d say base 1, +1 for versatility, +2 for ability to go from Power 3 to Power 4, +3 for ability to go from VA 1 to VA 2, for a total of a 7 point trait. So much more than 2 points, I’d disallow, hands down.

That looks like the basis behind the “Hands of Iron” Die Trait, as it grants a +1 Power Bonus to hands and feet.

Practiced Precision grants a reduction to the action costs of a combat activity.

Great Strike is a combat activity, and as such, the specifics of its effects are already taken into account in Fight! no need to reinvent it as a new Die Trait.

I stand corrected.

I’m still pretty sure I would throw dice at anyone who showed up to the game claiming their character’s “trademark action” as defined under the trait was “Great Strike”, since that is an out of game mechanic, not an in game character action, drawing/knocking an arrow (both common combat PPs) happens to be both, but strike and GS are abstractions of any number of different in-game actions.

Now, if they described a specific technique of hitting really hard like, say, “He raises his ax above his head and brings it down on his opponent with both hands in an instant”, that fits the criteria in the trait, and also opens up possibilities like your rival having trained to counter your technique.

The way Great Strike is written I envision a “set-up” before the strike, similar to the way one might focus before breaking a brick, board or sheet of ice (think Karate Kid) where as a Practiced Precision Great Strike would be similar to delivering an Axe Kick, Spining Back Kick, Roundhouse, or any of the other powerful attacks a practiced martial artist might bring to the table. It also works well for those who have Practiced Precision with there favorite weapon to increase the force of a strike by using its momentum to follow through instead of strike, reset, strike.

Whereas Deadly Precision allows your character to substitute their Skill exponent for I/M/S instead of using their Power exponent.

I agree that reducing the action cost of Great Strike was probably not the intent of the RAW, especially since it appears to be designed for actions taking more than two actions (else the “reduce by one action rather than to one action” wouldn’t be relevant. I also agree that using it for that is cheesy and munchkinish. I just don’t see anything in the rules that forbid it. That seems to be Rule Zero territory.

Could you use Practiced Precision to lower all of your Physical Actions in Fight! to 1 action rather than 2? If not, why not? Does the same reason apply to Great Strike?

My answers:
Practiced Precision refers to a signature move, and not all Physical Actions are that signature move.
The same reason does apply to Great Strike. You must name your signature move. Then, in the chaos of Fight!, if you attempt to Great Strike with one action and the GM rules that your signature move cannot work in this specific situation, you Hesitate instead, or maybe you can Great Strike at +1-2 Ob.

For example, if your signature move is to use your existing momentum from the previous action to spin and deliver a powerful blow with your trusty axe whose balance you know so well, then it will certainly fizzle if you don’t have your axe or if your previous action was Hesitating, and I think it would also fail if your opponent is just running away or if you are wearing an abnormally heavy backpack.

So Practiced Precision was never intended to be applied to the Great Strike maneuver, and even though it isn’t specifically disallowed, this is a loophole that should be closed.

If that’s the opinion of the Forum, that’s how it should be.

Thanks Everyone!