I’m GMing a group and we’re all new to MG. I know everyone says to start with pregens & a pre-made mission, but everyone was really pumped to make their own characters, so that was never going to work. The hardest part of the character generation was coming up with Beliefs and Instincts. We ended up playing a session (where we basically got through the GM turn before we had to stop) and Beliefs and Instincts hardly seemed to come up. Partly this is because they didn’t have them finished before we met, so I had to make a mission and hope it’d fit well. It went really well, but I’d like to be able to have that extra oomph from really challenging BIGs for future sessions. I can’t tell if I’m having trouble thinking of ways to challenge them or if they’re weak and need changing or refinement. (I’m having more trouble with some than others.) Here they are:
Lucien (a Healer who’s big on compassion)
B: Love should walk hand in hand with action.
I: To help those in distress.
Ivy (obviously, honesty is a big deal for her; her enemy is her cousin, a merchant, whom she had a falling out with after seeing him cheat a customer)
B: There’s no excuse for dishonesty.
I: Never break a promise.
Joseff (has a pretty broad skillset – nothing at a high level, but many different skills – with several that tie into cooking; also, he’s Rational and Curious; also, he had the worst time coming up with anything – he’s my nearly 8 year old son and he ended up going with suggestions we gave him, but now I’m not so sure they were good suggestions)
B: A mouse should take every opportunity to learn something new.
I: Always feed the patrol when we rest.
Lilac (she’s a Brewer to the core; and she stole Sadie’s Belief from the book :))
B: A guardmouse needs to be able to think with her head and act with her heart.
I: When scared, take a big swig of brew and run into battle.
What do you think? Some of them I think are pretty good, but others I’m just not sure what to do with.
Belief is pretty passive, and fairly vague. If it were Compassion, instead of Love, it would be READILY challengeable. Otherwise, pin the player down with threats to family, or make them have a defined lover… Not great as is for the mission based structure.
The instinct is readily used to cause trouble. Just put in a critter in distress just before turning it over to the player turn… Make them use checks to pursue it… I’m evil, aren’t I.
Belief is great - just give them orders to conceal something from someone else.
Instinct seems to overlap too much, and would be great for BW (where Instincts are “action macros”) - but not so good for BW where they’re really just a second belief.
Belief is ill suited to basic missions, but if you leave a mission to be resolved in the player turn, and the choice is “study something at location X” -or- “Complete the mission”…
great instinct - but beware the problem it bears with: It can be used to justify multiple uses of the Conflict system when an opposed roll would do.
May want to add an intoxicated condition, just in case - Recovers just after tired, by sleeping it off, Ob 1 health.
Lucien (a Healer who’s big on compassion)
B: Love should walk hand in hand with action.
I: To help those in distress.
B: ok, so Love is action not words. If it seems the player is cool with constantly drawing in a Friend/Lover who wants to hear the love expounded in poetic verse, melodic lyric, or just downright kind words, that can stress the challenge. But it could also lead to a player feeling unappreciated by the Friend/Lover. No one would enjoy frequent complaints. On the other hand, perhaps the Friend/Lover is frequently a second priority to the Guard and duties; the challenge becomes one of ensuring that the PC follows thru on the loving words with actions that illustrate love. Most of all I’d ensure the PC has a Lover or at least a primary target of love. Don’t allow the belief to be about generally treating everyone with brotherly/sisterly love.
I: needs a bit of wording to make it into a trigger-action format, but the general idea gets across. Sounds more like a Belief than an Instinct right now. Might be that it is a candidate for a future Belief. Seems easy to challenge if it were a Belief.
Ivy (obviously, honesty is a big deal for her; her enemy is her cousin, a merchant, whom she had a falling out with after seeing him cheat a customer)
B: There’s no excuse for dishonesty.
I: Never break a promise.
B: ok, but does it really say something about the mouse or is it about other mice. Encourage player to internalize the Belief to the PC; seems rather extroverted and judgmental, rather than introspective and sentimental. Example: My own true word will ring with clarity among a sea of deception, aka Truth will be louder than lies.
I: pretty large Instinct and looks like a mini-Belief. Doesn’t appear to have a clear trigger, but could lead to complications if not fulfilled. Since there is no reward for not fulfilling an Instinct, that isn’t worth much. Encourage player to consider a trigger-action format. Example: When I hear a mouse lie, I will tell the truth, if I know it.
Joseff (has a pretty broad skillset – nothing at a high level, but many different skills – with several that tie into cooking; also, he’s Rational and Curious; also, he had the worst time coming up with anything – he’s my nearly 8 year old son and he ended up going with suggestions we gave him, but now I’m not so sure they were good suggestions)
B: A mouse should take every opportunity to learn something new.
I: Always feed the patrol when we rest.
B: excellent, best yet, fantastic. Easy to challenge (e.g. learn something new by trying to do, or have the expert do it right the first time?). Easy to act toward or against (rewards for both, even in the same session). Easy to extend; easy to internalize (e.g. PC should learn new things, PC should encourage others to learn new things). I might suggest it leads to a future Belief of, ‘A Guard mouse should take every opportunity to teach something to settlement mice.’
I: good. stated in action-trigger format. Action clearly identified; trigger clearly identified. Takes up a small space in any session. Might require check/test; could be satisfied by variety of skills or abilities. Can be ignored when not fulfilled. Doesn’t appear too be Belief; firmly resides as Instinct. good.
Lilac (she’s a Brewer to the core; and she stole Sadie’s Belief from the book :))
B: A guardmouse needs to be able to think with her head and act with her heart.
I: When scared, take a big swig of brew and run into battle.
B: good, great, superb. Uses existing example; try thinking of similar challenges (as canon) initially, then branch out. easy to internalize; not hard to extend. Requires action and thoughts; this means the player has to open up about thoughts, intents, actions of PC. It is defining of the PC attitudes and desires. One question: what might be a future Belief after this has been challenged repeatedly over a handful of sessions or more?
I: (what I am about to input is personal opinion and should be taken lightly) Really?! Face fears with alcoholism? Also, this requires the PLAYER admit to fear on behalf of the PC more often than it allows for GM to declare fear on behalf of PC. Yes, it has trigger-action format, but the trigger is [perhaps] a case of GM overstepping by telling the player what the PC is feeling. Not inappropriate, but not a best case either. Trivializes tone of campaign if GM wants to drive PCs into resolving problems through non-combat skills/abilities. Trivializes bravery, fearlessness, recklessness, alcoholism. Least important observation: seems rather selfish and spotlight hogging (e.i. Look at me! I’m drunk and acting out! It’s just how I deal with emotions.)
What do you think? Some of them I think are pretty good, but others I’m just not sure what to do with.
Well, my thoughts are as written. I’d encourage a bit of revision, but maybe not until after the first session or two while players try to get a feel for the game with the BIGs as-is. Once they see how it settles, they might come up with more organic growth in writing BIGs.
I think this Belief is supposed to be about Compassion. He went for flowery language, and I always have to think about what he actually meant. I’ll get him to clarify. If it is about Compassion, how would you challenge it? I’m thinking, put an enemy or a large animal (he’s frightened of those) in trouble and see if he’ll still act kindly.
Yeah, I think a better wording would be nice, but this one’s fun. We’ve played one session (write up here) and the GM turn ended with a raccoon carrying off a handful of mice and most of the rest of the town suffering from an epidemic (bringing them meds & helping the sick was the mission and he’s a Healer). He’s only got his free check (they haven’t yet figured out – or forgot – the earning checks part), so who do you help?
I think it’s more for everyone, including herself. I.e., never be dishonest and never allow others to be dishonest.
I agree, and I think she’s been thinking they’re too similar, too. I like the idea of making it into a specific trigger. I’ll bring it up to her.
That’s how I was viewing it. Other than putting the patrol in situations where either no one has an applicable skill (“If someone’s going to learn something new, it better be me”) or where someone’s obviously the expert (“I know you’re the pro here, but let me try it out”), how can I as the GM challenge this? Or is it something he’d have to just really try to bring up?
I like the idea of expanding it to a teacher’s role. The biggest challenge here is that the player’s only just under 8 years old and more mathy than verbal, and I think I’ll have to suggest (or encourage the other players to suggest) that he might want to try the new thing or move into teaching. He tends to forget to offer suggestions. Or maybe that’s just a “new to the game” thing that anyone would have to get familiar with.
Good idea! Something similar to requiring a Health test for spending a long time in snow?
Yeah, in a way it’s a joke Instinct, albeit one that’s in line with the character. I don’t have her stat sheet in front of me, but she has, I think, the highest Brewer stat you can start with (4); her Senior Artisan was a Brewer; her Friend is a barmaid; her parents were Brewers… You get the idea.
We’ll see how it plays out, but I think it could work really well. If I can present potentially scary situations (big animal, massive flood, fire, angry mob, etc), hopefully she’ll go with it and run into “battle” whether it’d appropriate or not. It might be fun to put her in a bad situation for running in, sword swinging, when that’s a bad response. (Similar to Saxon’s “Always draw my sword at the first sign of trouble.”)
I see what you mean about trivializing things. I think if there are strong enough consequences we can avoid that. And if she never gets to use her instinct because it makes no sense for the situation, (and thus gets no reward) maybe she’ll reconsider it. But I think it might be fun to explore.
Yeah, I think for now I’ll just ask for some clarifications, and try to push them to play their BIGs in-game. Does anyone feel like a little hand-holding is necessary for the first few sessions, or do players usually pick up on it after suffering the consequences (or absence of rewards, anyway) of not incorporating them? (Maybe you don’t have to answer that here because I’m pretty sure I saw it discussed elsewhere in the forums.)