Kickstarter Thief Clarification/Feedback

Hi All!

I’m looking for a little clarification on the “Special Skill” section of the Human Thief. It says that if you choose Criminal, that you start with Criminal at rank 4 instead of 3. Does this mean the base skill of Criminal that you already get for being a Thief set at 3? Or another set of criminal starting at 4? I’m struggling to find an example why you would ever choose to bump a skill up by 1 rank instead of getting a free skill from outside of you base skill list at rank 3. Is that because this is the only human class that contains a skill from the human bonus skill table?

Also, I find it interesting that the Thief doesn’t follow the Human 4/3/2/2/2 skill point pattern. Not bad, just very interesting.

I did not understand that too. I thought with raw skill Criminal 3 every human could get Criminal 4 if he chooses Crimnal again. So that does not sound special.

I like the idea of 3/3/3/2/2 as it makes the thief more versatile. With Manipulator and Scout you highlight other aspects of stealth based characters.

I am not sure if Scout is the Stealth skill equivalent in Torchbearer but I think this might be. Crimnal for pick pocket, disarm traps and open locks. Scout for obsevations and sneaking around.

If I get the advancement system right thiefs might advance those Skill 3s very fast. That woulf be very D&D basic-like.

The thief is human and so gets the choice of the human special skill like other humans: Criminal, Haggler, Pathfinder or Survivalist.

Since the Thief already has the Criminal skill, choosing it here would increase your Criminal from 3 to 4. 4 is the maximum starting skill rating for any skill. By taking Criminal here, the Thief has the option to take Haggler or Scout as his specialty, allowing him to start with two skills rated at 4, which is a sweet deal.

Or the Thief can choose one of the other skills here and choose Criminal as his specialty to bump his skill up to 4.

Criminal is the skill for sleight of hand, picking pockets and picking locks. Scout is the skill for sneaking and spotting, including traps.

Ah, I see it now!

So, as your human skill bump Criminal to 4 and take a specialization in Dungeoneer, Manipulation or Scout and start with two 4’s. Sweet!

Since “Scout” is the sneaking skill, and Halflings have “sneaking” as part of their Nature… how does that work? A halfling burglar can just use either (presumably the higher of two), while a human thief just uses Scout?

Does that have implications as to who can Help? (Attributes help Attributes, Skills help Skills)

If you have the skill, you can’t use your Nature instead. But you can Tap your Nature (which allows you to add your Nature dice to the roll) without taxing it as you would if it were outside your Nature.

Unless I’m reading it wrong, you could take your Human skill as Criminal, giving you Criminal 4; Manipulator as your Social Graces, giving you Manipulator 4; and Scout as your Specialty, giving you Scout 4; for 3 skills at Rating 4.

I did exactly what Hirram is talking about when making my thief, Black Leaf (posted over at The Inn). Seems like a bit much, but is apparently legal by the rules.

I asked this somewhere else on the internet, but I can’t remember where.

Will the thief rules (and character-building questions) be in the main rulebook, or is the PDF the final home for those rules?

The PDF, unless I am greatly mistaken, is an excerpt from the book. Thus the thing about placeholders for the art that something said somewhere.

No. The classes in the preview are the only classes that will appear in the book. For now, the Thief will exist as a PDF and we will provide more information (like leveling options) in that format.

Cool. I like the simplicity of the 6 classes as they are.

Oh, the Thief is an extra thing. I missed that somehow.