So we had another session of Buring Empires last Saturday. I succeeded in not injuring myself further.
But in the process we came up with a few questions.
1.) Once I successfully Assess the factions or the PCs, is that permanent? Do I have to successfully Assess the PCs each Phase if I want to be able to Take Action against them in that Phase? My reading of the rules is I must re-Assess each phase.
2.) I Assess and then Take Action against a Faction. I immediately add the Dispo of the Faction for this phase to my sides Dispo. The Faction cannot be taken over by the oppostion. Can the opposition Take Action to destroy it for this phase?
2a.) At the start of the next phase, do I have to Take Action against the Faction again in order to get the Dispo points for that Faction that Phase?
2b.) At the start of the next phase, am I still considered to be "in control" of the Faction?
Our reading is that if we must re-Assess and Take Action each phase to keep control of a Faction, then it doesn’t seem worthwhile to take over Factions. You have to blow two actions and then you get a few piddly Dispo points.
1.) Once I successfully Assess the factions or the PCs, is that permanent? Do I have to successfully Assess the PCs each Phase if I want to be able to Take Action against them in that Phase? My reading of the rules is I must re-Assess each phase.
Yes, you must re-assess each phase.
2.) I Assess and then Take Action against a Faction. I immediately add the Dispo of the Faction for this phase to my sides Dispo. The Faction cannot be taken over by the oppostion. Can the opposition Take Action to destroy it for this phase?
No, you have won the faction, and their dispsotion bonus. you opposition may take action to reduce your disposition and narrate that it is a direct counter to your controling the faction, but that is a narrative choice, and of course subject to negociation.
2a.) At the start of the next phase, do I have to Take Action against the Faction again in order to get the Dispo points for that Faction that Phase?
2b.) At the start of the next phase, am I still considered to be “in control” of the Faction?
Yes you must take action again (after assessing them) to control or destory them for that phase. You could lose them to the oppositino this way.
It does take (at least) two action to gain a faction. If you look at it only as a Dispo Bonus then your right, there are peraps better things to do. On the other hand you have to look at what they have to offer you. You can callup their members, gain their equipment, and use their connections. That is what controling (or destroying) a faction can get you, and the reason you do it.
You have to Assess the factions each Phase. But remember that you don’t Assess individual factions. You could Assess the Factions in one maneuver and then activate three separate factions in the following three maneuvers.
Whether it’s worth it depends on the faction you’re trying to take over. A 5-point faction is nothing to sneeze at. Especially if you’re well behind the opposition.
But remember that you don’t Assess individual factions. You could Assess the Factions in one maneuver and then activate three separate factions in the following three maneuvers.
We did notice that. Sadly, most of our factions don’t offset the gi-normous edge the Vaylen have this phase.
One follow-on question. Vaylen take control of the Kern Faction. One of the PCs (and a Figure of Note) is the leader of the Kern on the planet. How much control can the Vaylen actually exert through the Faction without the Kern leader noticing? Is there some kind of circles test involved? If the Kern leader can discover the Vaylen control, can he do anything about it by virtue of being the acknowledged leader?
Yes, you can win a faction over in play and still have it wrenched from your grasp by losing the Infection.
And Tom, to answer your various questions, these are the mechanics of sweeping change and betrayal. All sorts of stuff can be going on behind the scenes in the factions. You can be a figure of note and lose control of your faction. If it’s important to you for that not to happen, then activate that faction in play. Secure it!
Because once someone successfully activates a faction, it’s theirs for the phase. You want to fight for it? Well, it’s too late. You should have fought for it from the beginning. Given the mechanics of the Assess - Take Action, it’s usually quite clear when one side is going to take a swipe at the factions. You can protect them with a Flak or Go to Ground.
Our problem here is, by the time we win over a faction he’ll have dealt more damage to our disposition than it was worth in the first place – the phase will end before we can make use of it.
The art of scripting in Burning Wheel/Burning Empires is leading your opponent, much like in boxing or chess or football or pitching in baseball.
Work him over and get him to do what you want him to do. It sounds like you’re pretty sure that your opponent is going to script a Take Action in the next maneuver. So script a Conserve and rebuild your Disposition. Put him on defensive footing and he’ll script a Flak. You want to guage when he’s going to do that and drop a Pin on him. Follow the Pin up with a Take Action to seize a faction.
Also, keep in mind that factions are more than just a pile of numbers. They’re an entity in the game fiction you’re creating together, and that can have all sorts of ramifications.
In one of our last playtest games, Luke’s Vaylen villain took control of the Military Junta faction, and his phase objective was to change the primary government…to a military dictatorship.
When that phase was over, Luke’s character ruled the planet, because she controlled the Junta and the Junta controlled the planet. In the next phase, the Junta would be up for grabs again, but by default she was able to order members of the Junta around and use them to oppose our goals. Even without the mechanical elements, that was an extremely important development.
I was also able to then hull the whole of the Junta as part of my epilogue! Fun stuff. And it wouldn’t have been half as fun unless – say it with me now – I had Assessed the Factions.
Actually, most of our scripting to date has been pretty direct action-oriented (take action/flak for maneuvers – point/rebuttals for DoW). A lot of the more “fiddly” actions seem less useful, espeically when the disparity between the dispositions is really big or really small. I’m sure we’ll all get a little better at this over time.
Oh! Damn, I thought that once you took a Faction, you had it for the rest of the campaign, unless someone eliminated it from play with a phase goal. But you only hold it for the rest of the phase and it goes up for grabs again in the next phase? Right. Hmm.
I’ll have to go over the rules again. Wonder what else I misread?
(EDIT: ) One quick question, though: The book seems a little vague on attacking a faction rather than co-opting it. If you Take Action against a faction and opt to attack, you get the Dispo bonus for the rest of the phase, but what happens to the faction? Is it gone for the rest of the campaign, or is it just considered “attacked” during this phase, recovering and becoming available again in the next phase?
In other words, is colour the only difference between attacking and co-opting?
Does that hold for the opposition as well? IE, do you have to only Assess at most twice per phase, once for the Factions, once for the opposition? Or do you need to Assess for each Take Action, Gambit, or Pin against the opposition?
If you Assess the Disposition and you Assess the Factions, you do not need to Assess again. All options are open to you. However, Assess still makes a useful block to a number of maneuvers.
