Helping with Nature and Beginner’s Luck in Conflicts

A question about helping with Beginner’s Luck in conflicts.

According to Luke’s clarification in this thread, you can use Nature to help in conflicts. I had assumed that the rules rules for “Helping in Conflicts” (p. 73) were worded to exclude Nature and Beginner’s Luck, in addition to other skills:

Helpers may only help if they have the ability or skill listed for the current action. If they do not, they can use the I Am Wise rule (if appropriate) or sit out this action.

So, Nature is in. Can you use Beginner’s Luck as well?

You can’t help with beginners luck at any time. Nature has a special quality that allows it to be used as help.

Ack … of course. Sorry. Too much heat and not enough sleep.

BL can help BL, that’s it. Can’t help Nature or skills.

BL can help BL? I totally missed this…

Has anyone ever thought of compiling a comprehensive chart that explains what can help what? I’d be sold.

Abilities helped by: same abilities (Will, Health, Resources, Circles)
Skills helped by: Skills, Nature if the test situation falls under a descriptor
Beginners Luck helped by: Beginners Luck, Skill, Nature if test falls under a descriptor
Nature (as stand-in for a skill) helped by: Skill, Nature if test falls under a descriptor
Nature (in service of a descriptor ) helped by: Nature if test falls under a descriptor, skill if appropriate?

That’s how we’ve done it so far. Although a quick look at the helping section has me second guessing whether anything but Nature can help Nature. By the letter, it seems not. When people have substituted Nature for a missing skill it just made since that the actual skill could be used to help, but we may have been wrong there.

That said, I kind of wish BL couldn’t help BL. It can create this weird little spot at the low end of the skill ranks where its better for a beginner to test with everyone helping than it is for the skilled party member to test without the help of the beginners.

But this is a feature, not a bug. Otherwise, you have the tyranny of the skilled player in which unskilled players sit on their hands while the highly skilled do everything. Instead, you have situations in which everyone is helping the beginners.

Yeah, I can see that. It certainly reinforces the importance of everyone working together, no dead weight. Except, you know, the actual dead.

Testing by yourself also insulates the rest of the group from conditions from failure.

I think that it’s also interesting from a roleplay perspective. The scene should play out no differently at the table than in real life when a bunch of people who don’t know what the hell they’re doing all try to accomplish something new for the first time.

I think that an applicable Wise can help in each case too. And insulate from failure conditions.

I think that an applicable Wise can help in each case too. And insulate from failure conditions.

Aid from a Wise is not technically help. You can use a Wise to provide a die even when you’re Afraid, or when one of your companions is using an Instinct.

Now that is really a valuable reminder.

What exactly does this mean? Does a character need a test recorded for Beginner’s Luck in Peasant in order to help another character make a Beginner’s Luck test in Peasant? Or, does it simply mean that a character untested in Peasant can help with the relevant ability for the skill (in this case Health)? I have been running my game the second way based on the “Helping Beginners” section.

Anyone can help with Beginner’s Luck. Beginner’s Luck uses either Health or Will, and everyone has those.

Okay. Thanks for the clarification. I was just confused by the “BL can help BL” rather than Health or Will can always help BL.

One more related question… When helping, the helper does or does not record a pass/fail for the check?

He does if he spends a check.

Stay cool :cool: